Saints health results

It has taken me some time to write this blog, I most say that I’m a little bit disappointed because Saint is a really really good dog. But atbthe same time she has some excellent results also. Her results:

  • HD: C/C
  • ED: 0/0
  • PL: 0/0 (done by approved tester but not registrated)
  • Back, from neck too tail: no abnormalities and no signs of spondlioses (not official reading in Norway)

So her only bad result is HD. And I will check her again in 6 months. There are not signs of calcificaton. They had huge problems putting her strait so I did believe that there was some problems with her pelvis, but they came back with no remark. Next time I will go to a animal hospital who has radiographer. It might not make a difference, but with her I feel like it’s worth using the money to try again. Her temper, work ethic, social behaviour, play is everything I wanted.

Just for the record, I do not blame anyone for this. And Saint can live happily with NO restriction on work or life! As a breeder I know all to well that there is always a risk when you get a puppy.

If it does not work out, I might just have to make a plan B. (As always 😂)

Health in kelpie

This is a translated re-blog that was in Norwegian. Thank you so much Tonje for translating for meg (Tonje owns Strider and Shy)

Kelpies and Disease
The statistics are in general good when it comes to the most tested ailments: HD&AD. There is a low percentage that gets any remarks, and an even lower%  that actually get problems with their remark. PL does appear here and there, to a more or less serious degree, but fortunately most with diagnosed PL have it to a lesser extent. These are things which I believe should be checked on all dogs used for breeding (I get PL checked by chiropractor and therefore not official result).
Backs have come into focus, especially after Finland got a good system fro registering that. There are many with remarks, but also in this case with varying degrees of severity. In general I believe that all breeding dogs and dogs that are being used actively, should Xray their backs simply to get an understanding of the physical start point for these dogs. So far I have owned/bred dogs that have had fusion between vertebrae in the pelvis, had a vertebrae missing compared to the normal and others again with LTV4. They don’t necessarily struggle with skeletal problems, but the muscles around the defects come under extra load. The breed is active, the breed really uses their body – so a breeding dog should not start out with any defects in the back, unless in such a mild degree that it would never ever give symptoms or problems. The hereditary pattern is unknown, and of course later back problems kan be due to use, accidents, lack of warming up +++
All the above are things that dogs rarely die from, and can be treated, given pain medication and adapted training. There are not many dogs that die from these ailments (but of course, some one here and there may be extremely unlucky).
And then we have the heart..
From RAS in Sweden (breed description/strategy):
4.4. Heart defects
Statistics from Agria Breed Profile show that the AK is the victim of more heart defects than the average breed.
4.4.1 Endocardos/Chronic mitralinsufficiancy
Chronic mitralinsufficiancy (also know as endocarps) is a disease that gives a degeneration of the valves between the for- and heart chamber in the heart but is also a disease that can be acquired. Affected dogs must not be used for breeding.
4.4.2 DCM
DCM stands for Dilated CardioMyopathy which means weakness of the heart muscle. Diagnosing this condition, requires ultrasound investigation of the heart. The disease is hereditary and affected dogs must not be used for breeding. Some intermittent individuals have been diagnosed with DCM.
Mitralinsufficiense is what one sees the most of. And on young dogs, we are talking about down to 2-3 yrs of age. The development is pr today unknown, but one both knows of and hears about kelpies who either get heart failure or have to be put to sleep due to heart complications before they are 10 years old. I.E. BEFORE they are 10 and even younger  and then after having to adapt their lives the last year or two so as not to overload the heart+medication. A healthy breed should not have any of these problems apart from anything due to accident or injury.
Many seem to believe it is enough to only listen to the heart, but is it really that simple? I know about several who have been told that the heart is hunky-dory when listening to it with stethoscope, but become ill a short time afterwards. I know about several whom have been listened to and then done ultrasound to discover they have obvious leakages in the mitral valves.
That ultrasound MUST be done before breeding, and not older ultrasound examination than 1 year, should be self-evident? And then one can argue back and forth about how expensive this examination is and bla bla. But if you  actually plan to have a litter and can estimate an average of eg 6 puppies, then add 500-1000 kr (approximately 100 EUR) pr puppy and you have covered the ultrasound expenses for both the bitch and the dog.  And the puppy buyer should be overjoyed that you actually check this, even if the puppy becomes a tad more expensive. Because if you do an ultrasound and get a remark, then what?  Then you have saved potential puppy buyers the real of loosing their dog too early. I call that win win!
There are other diseases one should be aware of, like EP and allergies are increasing etc. But these are ailments that can’t be pretested for in any way. The other diseases above, can be to a great extent tested for prior to breeding. Both EP and allergies may set in suddenly, but at the same time it may come to light that «someone» hasn’t told the full truth and the whole truth about siblings/parents/relatives.  Or such things have simply not been taken into consideration.  But this is something that is hard to demand for a puppy buyer, because it is something that requires a lot of knowledge and interest into digging into breedlines (inserted by Translator, assume that is what is meant)  – and last but certainly not least: that everyone are open and honest.
When all this is said, I must add that these are my own thoughts, I am not in any form of board or breed committee. I have not had any special breeders in my mind, but this is meant as information for those whom are looking at the breed. In general the kelpie is a healthy breed, but this will not continue through many future generations if health is not taken seriously even at a micro level.

Sykdom kelpie

Jeg har skrevet litt om hva jeg mente om mentalitet på kelpie før, utifra mitt ståsted, og det ble veldig mange kommentarer rundt det innlegget. Blant annet at jeg burde bytte rase ettersom jeg ikke var fornøyd 😉  Du kan lese det innlegget her, og stort sett så mener jeg det samme i dag. «Jeg vil ha en hund med alt»

Så kan vi snakke om sykdom. Stort sett så er statistikken fin når det kommer til det som undersøkes mest: HD & AD, de er en lav % som har anmerkning og en enda lavere % som får problemer med sin anmerkning. PL forekommer og anmerkning på øyner forekommer i mer eller mindre alvorlig grad, heldigvis de fleste i mindre grad. Men alt dette mener jeg at en avlshund bør sjekke. (PL får jeg sjekket av kiropraktor og dermed ikke offisielt)

Rygg har fått fokus, spesielt etter at Finland fikk ett bra system for det. Det er mange med anmerkning, men også her i en mild eller mer alvorlig grad. Generelt så mener jeg alle avlsdyr OG hunder som brukes aktivt bør røntgen hele ryggen sin rett og slett for å ha en forståelse av hva utgangspunktet til hundene her. Så langt har jeg selv eid/avlet hunder som har hatt fusjon i mellom virvler i bekkenet, hatt en virvel for lite i forhold til normalen og andre igjen med LTV4 som ikke nødvendigvis sliter med skjelettet men muskelaturen rundt blir belastet. Rasen er aktiv, rasen belaster kroppen sin veldig mye – så en avlshund bør ikke som utgangspunkt starte med defekter i ryggen som ikke er av en veldig mild grad som aldri har gitt symptomer. Arvegang er ukjent og selvsagt kan ryggproblemer senere være påvirket både av bruk, uhell, manglene oppvarming +++

Alt dette over er det skjeldent noen hunder dør av, det kan behandles, få smertelindrende og tilpasse trening. Det er ikke mange hunder som dør med anmerkning på noe av dette (men selvsagt en og annen som har ekstremt uflaks)

Så har vi hjerte..

Hentet fra RAS i Sverige:

4.4. Hjärtfel

Statistik från Agria Breed Profile visar att Australian Kelpie drabbas av hjärtfel i något högre grad än medelrasen

4.4.1. Endocardos/Kronisk mitralisinsufficiens

Kronisk mitralisinsufficiens (även känt som endocardos) är en sjukdom som ger degeneration av klaffarna mellan förmak och kammare i hjärtat och är en sjukdom som också kan förvärvas. Affekterade hundar ska inte användas i avel.

4.4.2. DCM

DCM står för dilaterad cardiomyopati vilket innebär hjärtmuskelsvaghet. För att fastställa diagnos krävs ultraljudsundersökning av hjärtat. Hunden är oftast symptomfri tills den får hjärtsvikt. Sjukdomen är ärftlig och affekterade hundar skall inte användas i avel. Enstaka individer är diagnostiserade med DCM.

Mitralinsufficiens er vel det man ser mest av. Og da på unge hunder, vi snakker ned i 2-3 års alder. Utviklingen er for nå ukjent, men man både vet om og hører om kelpie som enten får hjertesvikt eller avlives pga de begynner få komplikasjoner med hjerte før de er 10 år. altså FØR 10 år og enda yngre og da gjerne tilpasset liv over 1 år eller to for å ikke anstrenge hjertet + medisinering. Noe en frisk rase ikke burde ha noe problem med å bli så lenge det ikke skjer en ulykke eller skade som skaper problemer.

Flere mener det er «bare til å lytte på hjerte». Men er det virkelig så enkelt? Jeg vet om flere som har fått beskjed om at hjerte er tipp-topp ved lytting og kort tid etter blir syke. Jeg vet om FLERE som har blitt lyttet på før de har gjort ultralyd av hjertet som viser seg ha ganske greie lekkasjer i mitral klaffen.

At ultralyd på hjertet er noe som MÅ gjøres før avl, og ikke eldre ultralyd enn 1 år, det burde det ikke være noen tvil om vel? også kan man gjerne krangle om at det er dyrt blablablabla. Men om du faktisk har tenkt å ha kull og beregner ett snitt på feks 6 valper: så sleng på 500-1000 kr pr valp også du har dekket UL på både hannhund og tispe. Og der burde vel egentlig valpekjøper være lykkelig over at du faktisk gjør det selv om valpen blir dyrere vel? Og om du tar UL og det er anmerkning, hva da? Vel da har du muligens spart potensielle valpekjøpere fra å miste hunden sin før tiden. Win Win kaller jeg det.

Det fins andre sykdommer man også bør være oppmerksom på som EP, Allergi er stadig i anmarsj osv. men det er sykdommer som ikke kan testes på noen måte. Alt det over kan undersøkes i forkant i stor grad. Både EP og Allergi kan komme litt brått på, men samtidig viser det seg gjerne at det er «noen» som ikke har fortalt hele og fulle sannheten om søsken/foreldre/slektninger. Eller ikke tatt hensyn til. Men dette er noe som er vanskelig å kunne «kreve» som en valpekjøper for det er rett og slett noe som krever ren kunnskap og interesse av å grave – og ikke minst: at alle er åpen og ærlig.


Med alt dette sagt så kan jeg skrive at dette er bare mine egne tanker, jeg sitter ikke i noen form for styre eller avlsråd. Dette er ikke rettet mot noen spesielle, men mer ment som en informasjon til de som faktisk ser på rasen. Stort sette er kelpien en frisk rase, men om ikke helse taes på alvor alt fra micro nivå så vil det ikke fortsette på den måten igjennom mange generasjoner. 

MH Sinner & Saint. *updated*

Yesterday we went to Lomma in Sweden to do the MH with Sinner and Saint.

Saint almost 13 months old and Sinner almost 23 months old. Saint was doing it with two of her litter siblings.

Sinner is doing it again as he got hurt during the «jumping suite» last time, and never got to finish being scared of that part as I pulled him out of the test. So I was really wondering how he would react this time as he never got to stop reacting last time.

I did not film him as I was afraid that I did not have enough storage on my phone to do both of them. So I did priorities Saint there. I got a couple off clips from Åsa, but not the full MH. His protocol you can se here.

My comment to his MH:

Stupid dog! You can play, he just decided that TODAY is not the day to play…. Idiot :p

He is a dog that misses some «tools» for self solving when he gets scared. His only tool is his social security. But he lacks curiosity, has 0 stress and has 0 aggresjon. That makes it difficult when he can solve things by being social. With the jump suit he clearly tried finding a face. Every time he got close, he looked up and tried find a face to take contact with. And he dident find any and backed away again. It was not logical for him that the jump suit was decapitated *lol* He does the same with horses, dogs and sheep as with people, he searched for faces and analyse the face for the situation. So he with his «baggage» from the last time on the jump suit the reaction was not a surprise.

The sound went well. Not a big reaction, he has analysed at a distance – low curiosity – and comes when called.

Ghosts, the are normal. No need to react. See those everyday *lol* And again, low curiosity and comes when called.

Stupid dog again, that does not play. And has reaction to gun shoots. It was not a surprise. But I decided to go true with it. He has no huge reaction, if we do tracking, biking or anything very fun he has no reaction. But since he had very low play drive to day, he shows more reaction then normal. (that is also normal at a test since they have been pushed mentally). Normally he has no reaction in any environment. But those single gunshots I know he might react a bit with getting «worried» if he is not doing anything. But as you can se: not a huge reaction, more discomfort. He eats treats and does as he is told if I start to train him and giving him assessments.

First play (or no play :p ) :

First reaction to the jump suite

The last walk on the jump suit

Sinner sound

Sinner ghosts

Last play with shoots


So Saint. 13 months old, haven’t had her heat yet :p So a young dog in both age, mind and body :p  But she did great. You can she her protocol her, and I have her MH in full movie.

My comments, she shows very much how she is. Huge play and hunting drive, medium curiosity, very socially stable and 0 aggression. I think her curiosity will develop with age. Her two other siblings at the MH also did very good for there age.

With that said, regarding both dogs: In my daily life they are NOT allowed to run after people or too people we meet on our way. That is corrected by me. Thats because I do not want my dogs to run too people while I’m sitting on a horse, run to other dogs OR just make a «break» to check something out. They learn early on to stay by me and wait until I  come with them or give them a very clear «free» command. And of course that makes them a bit «bad» on the MH where its reworded to «pull out» and do stuff.

Saint was scared for the first time ever, that I have seen: the ghosts and used some time there. But she collected her self, solved it and was finished when it was checked out 🙂

And her are her MH in full 🙂

There has been some other nice DeepEyes results this weekend, but I hope I remember to blog about that later 😉